Fascinating ... A Short Overview of Fire in Victorian Plantations:

http://hancockwatch.nfshost.com/docs/fire.htm

A bare half a million people,200 thousand sustained by government support pensions and the like.Most wage earners employed in non government jobs earn $6000/$8000 per year less than their mainland counterparts.We are basically a dirt poor community with an appallingly low tax base. That is the reality of Tasmania.If you chose to live here,your decision,you have to take responsibility for that personal decision.Snivelling whinging bitching moaning and denying the reality of the situation is sadly pathetic and is totally unproductive.In fact it is harmful.Emergency services,health care, education,law enforcement will all be below mainland standards.Thats REALITY.

And you must accpt reality, never ever dare to change it. Good old Tassie reality.

And, obviously, Gregg, the quality of our representation. You forgot that bit.

Don’t forget to ask who will get the tender for the Bellerive Oval redevelopment.  The wonderfully multi-talented Hazell Bros perhaps?

I tend to overlook the ‘quality’ of our representation and focus instead on the ‘quantity’ of it. Why do I have 19 parliamentary representatives to achieve the nations lowest standards of everything?
Couldn’t that be achieved if I was represented by a single garbage collector or one farm labourer?

Our services are below mainland standards because…

we’ve got two houses filled with politicians, each with minders, cars, drivers, secretaries and each counting big salaries, massive benefits and generous pension.

the government is used as a vehicle for propping up the ‘businesses’ of failed ‘mates’ of the people in those two houses above.

the public services are filled with huge numbers of desk bound clerks, all with generous government benefits.

meanwhile the taxpayers who are forced to pay for that lot, are denied emergency services, sensible health care and so on.

Wake up!

We don’t need this any more.

We would be better off looking after ourselves.

Betcha there won’t be a delay in providing the $15 million for The Bellerive Boyz Club, will there Lara?

Bloody good comments. As a new returnee to this state it’s pretty gob smacking to see how State Gov’t. works (or doesn’t). Reckon what it will take something very dramatic to change any Governance ways in Tassie, dare I say, a Civil War! It may come to that anyway if the “Havenots” become too many. We have all had it too good for too long. We are way way over-governed including having the very highly funded position of “Governor”. What a JOKE for less than half a mill folks (reasonable sized Melbourne suburb!). I could go on and on, but I won’t, keep it simple stupid!! HT

Karl Stevens #6, I have read and re-read your post and still can’t decide that if I were a garbage collector or farm labourer, should I be offended? I work in neither of these occupations, but what the hell, I just want a ride on the ‘offended’ wagon!

eddie taylor 10 You make a valid point. If I were represented in 4 houses of parliament by one garbo that garbologist could possibly do a better job than my 19 current representatives. Then again they may not.

No wonder Lara is telling people to go to the Red Cross if they need help, because the Bellerive oval is a much higher priority than everything else, of course.

Well, let me qualify that. The Bellerive oval and the Hawthorn football club are on a par with funds for Forestry Tasmania and Ta Ann.

Just think how much else could be given to forestry corporations and their mates if they created more volunteers in non-essential services like health and education.  The model is already there, after all. Volunteer firefighters and the Red Cross should surely set the standard for getting rid of paid nurses, paramedics and teachers in the public sector.

Fifteen million for the Bellerive oval is nowhere near enough. It puts us to shame to consider that the emperor Nero turned the Colisseum into a lake where ships could fight to the bitter end and all we can do is a pittance in comparison.

Comment 9…Harold T…Hits the nail on the head with a prime example of mind boggling waste.Our Governor who caters for the ceremonial needs of 500 thousand people has his salary dictated by a connection to Federal judges.He pulls the same salary as the Victorian Governor who caters to population about 14 times larger than Tasmania….And similar circumstance apply to Public Servants.Department heads and the like…..The Hunter Valley in NSW Gippsland in Victoria both have roughly equal population to Tassie without the need for Governors or Dept heads.They operate at a regional level with appropriate salaries and conditions….Meanwhile Tassie survives as a charity basket case.The federal money take hard earned Mainlanders Tax and dole it out to Tassie to be wasted on higher levels of administration than a population of 500 thousand need.

The Federal Government should stop with the charity…force Tassie to outsource upper levels of Admin to the often duplicated Fed Dept or work a deal with Victoria to administer our health/education/Law enforcement etc.Every Tasmanian would be better off as part of regional Victoria or part of Melbourne suburb than they are currently….Except of course the fat cats soaking up the funds that could be better spent on Hospital beds and the like…Of course this is all known and filed away in too hard basket gathering dust and will never happen.

Richard Flannagans TASMANIAN DEVIL article

http://tasmaniantimes.com/index.php?/weblog/article/tasmanian-devil-the-full-new-yorker/

is well worth a read for his insights into why we are who we are in TAS.

Re comment 4
Simon..A democracy our politicians are of the people…hold that thought while you check our general education standard..literacy..numeracy…school leaving average age..percentage who go on further education…wind your way through the pollies web sites and check the Bios and remarkable lack of them referring to academic qualification.Especially in the Upper house..it is sadly frightening…thats Tassie

Re comment 3
A lot of cosmetic trimming could take place.BUT the economy of scale set in place by a population of 500 thousand with a large lump govt handout dependant renders Tassie as a self sufficient
State an impossibility.Reality…They got it wrong in 1901 we should never… have been made a state…and that is a too hard basket that no politician will face.

Lara’s sponsorship of a renovated Bellerive Oval makes perfect electoral sense. She, or her advisers, know that it would be a popular move, given the enthusiasm of the public for footy. It will only be implemented post election, which if Hodgman gets in will tie a large albatross around his neck. It’ll employ builders (everything in Tasmanian development employs builders: - not nurses, teachers or policemen, but new classrooms, hospital buildings and police houses). Most of all it will once again tie in mainland Australians to supporting the Tasmanian economy.

‘Let them eat cake’  resulted in a well merited severence.

Labour and its political largesse to the rabble will see a similar fall of the slicer come election day.

John Monash, I agree with your leading statements.I too think that the PM was genuine on the day of her visit to Dunalley!
I was talking to one of the local Federal Ministers Offices a few days ago and it became clear that the Air Force should have been involved in the Forcett fire emergency, after all they help in all sorts of emergencies as a part their routine training and value their service to both community as well as the military.
I wonder if that was discussed with Premier Gidding and would State Emergency Minister Justin O’Byrne actually been aware how to initiate this option to at least be available to assist with the aftermath straight after the fires!

I ran into a foresty worker who I know quite well he told me FT was geared up ready to the TFS call for arms on Fatal Friday, on early arrival at the scene there was nothing but confusion among the TFS organisers, FT work parties did what they are best at reading the lay of the land and the path of what was to be advancing fire and did what they could to start supression tactics.
I understand that there was a problem establishing dozer lines!  As one TFS crew told a FT crew” We’ve got no tracks to get a dozer into the fire! FT crew replied “Thats why we need a dozer to track its way into the fire edge so we can get your tankers in to commence watering the edges before it gets too hot to work closer to the fire edge!
Basically what I have been told is TFS is simply not organised to fight fires on the fire ground.
Isnt it the job of Incident Control Room to acknowledge that dozers would be made available and be brought on site by early am, better still be ready close to the site the day before!
I am led to beleive that a particular fuel reduction burn at Forcett smouldered for weeks with whisps of smoke regularly seen from the Arthur Highway leading up to the day of the fire. This is left FT workers wondering what TFS has been thinking about.
it seems that the basic rule has been broken, no mopping up edges working back into the fire followed up by regular partols until the fire was declared as out by a responsible office the TFS.

The State Government has failed to establish its post fire aid directly to the coal face and I think this directly linked to a State Government led by a Premier who has no nouse whatsoever in what emergency aid means.
Instead leaving to Red Cross, Salvation Army, Lions Club, Recreational Boating groups and range of volunteers to assist with all sorts of help including urgent feed for livestock welfare and fencing.
There is no doubt Aurora did a good job getting the power back on to the Peninsula.
Overall TFS should be a lot smarter with all of their smart new state of the art f/f equipment, however it seems there is still a lot to answer for, can they deal with an emergency leading up to a severe fire day! I am afraid not if the Forcett fire is anything to judge them by!

#13. I would use thw old chesnut about peanuts and monkeys but it seems even with high pay rates you can get the same,

#15 Its almosrt what all new projects are about, giving money to a construction company not meeting a prooven need.

#17. I hope those fire crewa leaders are brave enough to tell it like it is if we have a public inquiry.

As for not having a plan etc in place, it shows poverty of leadership and poor planning.

Robin,17: The problem is systemic. When there is a public inquiry I may have cause to comment further.

people would think twice about the bellerive oval if it had to pay rates & land tax.

#14 “wind your way through the pollies web sites and check the Bios and remarkable lack of them referring to academic qualification. Especially in the Upper house ... it is sadly frightening…thats Tassie”

Being an elitist does nothing for your credibility, nor the facts. Check out the lower house and every other government including senior bureaucrats for their “academic qualifications” and you will see the problems we have under that useless and false regime.

What’s frightening is, academics are so far up themselves they think having been to school and received slave programming, gives them the ability to run the state. Yet not one of them have any real life experience, knowledge or ability and the realities is the opposite to what you are trying to claim Put an academic in charge of something that’s real and effects the people and you end up with an expensive nothing.

Your statement Tas should never have become a state is insulting to Tasmanians, something you don’t seem to have any clue about. If this island was run by real thinking people and not empty headed clones, we would be totally self sufficient, have very high living standards, low costs and a beautiful safe environment. In reality there is no need for us to be a part of Australia if this island was run correctly, by and for the people and future.

#21 I generally avoid “me too-ing” but your last paragraph is spot on the money. Tassie has the potential to be something special.
Loser politicians and a cargo cult mentality seem to be the principal issues!

A.K. 21. You would have to agree that Tasmania could not become an independent state without a massive social security budget from day one. I believe that what’s preventing us from being ‘self sufficient’ is the cultural baggage we bought from England. Look at the ‘British Raj’ in India and see what a huge bureaucracy they built for themselves? Tasmania can safely go back to sleep and wait until it bankrupts the Commonwealth of Australia. Then questions will start getting answered.

#23 Doubt I could ever agree with a non Tasmanian making primitive dumb statements, this state has a large welfare budget because of the idiots running the country and state, many imported from Aus and only here for the power and money. It’s ignorant and elitist management that creates the problems, with a sensible approach these things are easily overcome. It should be a privilege to represent your people, not an economic windfall for doing absolutely nothing but stuff up.

If I was an elected Representative, I’d work for my current pension, plus some expenses and can’t fathom why we are paying such idiots so much for nothing but ideological idiocy. But it should be the people who decide what their representatives get, not senior bureaucrats and elitist idiots.

Welfare is a necessary evil to ensure people don’t completely fall through the cracks and it should be mandatory for every one to do some form of community work for their payments. Aged pensioners could work within schools or education centres passing on their life knowledge a few times a year, as it is all this knowledge is wasted and goes to the grave.

If we were to introduce community work experience for all kids from 16-20, so they got experience in every government department including health, policing, bureaucracy and every other department. It would change our state dramatically and create useful knowledgeable young, who at 20 would have the knowledge and experience to choose their life career. It would cut out youth unemployment and crime, solve the staffing problems of police, health and every other government department and introduce fresh new ideas as kids when given the opportunities and challenges come up with good ideas and outcomes. At the moment it’s a complete basket case of youth unemployment and crime. many are unemployable because they have no idea of real life and their current education doesn’t equip them for the real future in any way.

This state has everything it needs to say goodbye to current ideological idiocy, we can grow all our own fuel, food and have the opportunity to create high quality export markets for our goods and create a lifestyle which represents the 21st century and not the 18th as it currently does. Diesels to run on vegetable oils, change all other vehicles to electric, creating a new local industry. Change everyone outside urban areas to solar and wind with cheap super capacity over night storage and many of the problems we faced on the Tasman and else where would be overcome. Then we can reduce power prices for people and business, then export any excess power for profit, instead of currently a huge loss.

So much money goes out of this state to vested interests of the political system, it’s a crime this island is controlled by 3-4 companies who are closely aligned to the political parties via their supposed donations and have free reign to charge us what they want, to increase their profit margins at our expense. Then we have all these boards filled with ex pollies and their mates, none are needed in any way, put sane logical and experienced people into running those entities and we’d save millions every day.

Naturally this can only be achieved if the people are in control and not the idiots. So a voluntary referendum style government would be the only answer, then we would be responsible for our own decisions and outcomes, which is the only satisfactory way forward in the 21st century.

#22, thank you. I’m always amazed at how the real opportunities are discredited, buried and replaced with short term greed and elitism.

#24 So, so agree.  The sensible solutions which often stare us all in the face, are the first ones to be disregarded.

“It’s ignorant and elitist management that creates the problems, with a sensible approach these things are easily overcome. It should be a privilege to represent your people, not an economic windfall for doing absolutely nothing but stuff up.”

You have hit the nail on the head.

I know I bang on about Tourism Tasmania but I ‘try’ to make my living in this area and these ignorant, thoughtless, uncaring ‘job for life’, paid every fortnight, come what may toadies play God with the livlihoods of and are destroying the little people in tourism in this state.  Tourism Tasmania and TICT (hello, Luke) are only interested in Federal Hotels and the developers and self-styled ‘movers & shakers’ on the Tourism Tasmania Board and various related industry group hangers-on. (I can hardly wait for Luke’s reply!  Another great example of George Orwellian double-speak).)

Have a look at TIM (The latest Tourism Information Monitor) Highlights from July - September 2012 survey period.

It is hard to know whether to laugh or cry.

Two pages of politic-speak informing the local tourism community that TT continues to fail and that it is up to them to remedy the situation through “word of mouth” recommendations.  Every other state uses the traditional methods of advertising for tourism but not Tasmania - we rely on ‘word of mouth’.  We are wasting our money on this department.

If you are not Federal Hotels, David Walsh or a developer ‘mate’, you don’t exist.

All the little people knew we were on our own - now we have the written proof.

I just love the way that *sport* is supported here in Tassie.
I avidly watch the news on TV when it gets to the sports section and we see the players out here doing their thing. I have noticed on occasions that the camera lifts momentarily and we get a quick look at all the magnificent stands that have cost millions to build and they sometimes have ten or fifteen people in them.
Way to go.
What was that quaint saying the pollies were heard to trot out? was it “user pays”?
I do not use the stadiums but I no doubt pay.
Never mind it worked in Rome, “bread and circuses”.

What we need is an alternative means of democracy other than being forced to vote for someone selected by a political party, having no independent rights to assure some reliable level of value for our taxes, and having no means to police whatever promises are made to gain our votes.

Are new technologies giving us an answer?

But A.K. Tasmania’s problem (as you so rightly put it, living in the 18th century) is a local cultural issue. Most of Tasmania’s problems have arisen and become entrenched (its how we do things here; i.e. badly) precisely as a result of the people here being left to their own devices (and I’m one of them A.K. Left and returned, Which should be mandatory for all Tassies), the result being a neo-feudal peasant culture run by corrupt short-term self-interest, dependent on federal handouts for survival. We need people to come here with new ideas and new vision to fix this state. It does have fantastic potential. But we’ve had 200+ years on our own to prove we can’t do it. Sometimes you just have to face facts. A minority of intelligent people (none in power or related to those in power) and wishful thinking isn’t going to turn things around.

I understand the first part of your post and agree, but bringing more people from overseas wont help, only make it worse. I was born in Aus of Tasmanian parents and have a wide experience of both worlds, in business and privately. I live here because of that experience and in all ways it’s the only home I want, not another Aus or some other dying ideological society.

We are unique in the world, rather than be like the rest, we should be even more unique and provide a real example to Aus of how a successful society can be run. Not a reflection of the entrenched fatalistic approach of the current ruling ideologies in Aus, which by the way control us as well.

People who haven’t spent real time in Tas and learnt it’s unique culture, only want to change it to represent what they left behind. In this case, they are failing in Aus with everything they do in relation to the future, why would we want fools like that here. Don’t we have enough fools from overseas already having a lot of control and wrecking the place, as well as sending all our money and resources out of the island with little or no return for us.

I talk to many average Tasmanians every day and just about all have excellent idea’s and solutions for most of our problems they understand. A referendum style government would give us all the opportunity to have a real say, control our little country in our way and not as it is currently, by those from overseas.

I don’t mind pseudonyms, like the civil ‘John Monash’, as ‘known to Ed’, this article is relevant to Tas and constructively conveys an informed point of view.

On this basis, it is the message that has readership value, not the messenger.

Australia’s democratic freedom of speech principle demands that our right to be socio-political critical, even if robust and inflammatory, must be defended against government attempts at censorship.

Holding government officials to social account is a citizen right and John Monash does this well.
Politicians enter the frame of government responsibility on such publicly accountable basis.

Congratulations TT. Try finding such an article and comments in the Mercury or Advertiser or Examiner?

These dominions are an ancien regime.

This new media in TT needs to plan for the widening readership vacuum and be a player in shaping the new media landscape.

Tigerquoll
(not me real name)

I contend A.K. that our fundamental problem is that no-one is capable of making valid decisions for other people. That system has been tried and clearly found to be wanting.

Now we have mobile phones, pads and internet connections that allow us to gather information from wherever we like, and make our own decisions. e-voting software is available that provides reasonably robust security (better security is available on the .mil system).

Therefore we can start to find out from the people themselves, what they want, how much etc. as well as gathering useful ideas.

This can no longer be a one-size-fits-all world. We live in a pluralist society and need policies that satisfy as many disparate people as possible.

#32, Richard that’s why we need an on line referendum style of government, then the people would have a real voice and make their own decisions. Using voluntary voting and forums for idea’s, discussion and decision making, would bring forth many wonderful ideas from those with real experience in the subject being discussed. Making candidates for office criminally accountable for what they promise and say, would soon change the political scene. With only those registered to vote on line and proper moderation, again by the people this island would bloom.

Currently politicians, bureaucrats and corporate business can say and claim virtually what they want, without any reprisal. But the ordinary person would be jailed for the same deceptive and fraudulent claims, promises and acts of the current regimes.